#48: Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks)

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:00:00]:

We looked at it with, well, why aren't people riding? Like, what are the barriers to entry to riding a motorcycle? And then we made a vehicle that is a bicycle. That same vehicle, without changing any components, is also a moped, and that same vehicle, without changing any components, is also a motorcycle. And we do it through, software. Right? We're we're able to, physically manipulate the actual performance, the power output of the vehicle to where it meets 3 different criteria, defined by FMVSS and DOT. So we're making 1 vehicle that can be both a bicycle, moped, or a motorcycle.

Jeffrey Stern [00:00:42]:

Let's discover the Cleveland entrepreneurial ecosystem. We are telling the stories of its entrepreneurs and those supporting them. Welcome to the Lay of the Land podcast, where we are exploring what people are building in Cleveland. I am your host, Jeffrey and today, we are talking about a very fun assortment of things from manufacturing to motorcycles to electric vehicles and energy Distribution all here in Cleveland, Ohio. I had the pleasure of speaking with Scott Colosimo, who is the founder of Cleveland Cycle Works, a global motorcycle lifestyle brand which he founded back in 2009 here in Cleveland. Scott is also more recently, though, the founder of Land Energy. A hat tip to the same land of this podcast namesake. Land Energy focuses on distributed power and e mobility, and is obviously based here in Cleveland as well.

Jeffrey Stern [00:01:36]:

Land paints a fascinating vision for the future of motorcycles for mobility and for connectivity. I really loved hearing about Scott's transition from a focus on heritage and tradition to one of innovation and thoughtful applications of technology with, Really, a firm commitment to design tying it all together. I believe this conversation is actually greatly complemented with a visual counterpart. So definitely Would recommend browsing the interwebs on your search engine of choice and looking up Land Energy Emoto and Cleveland Cycle Works motorcycles to Visually understand what Scott means when he talks about his commitment to design. As a motorcyclist, it is hard for me to not be a huge fan of Scott's work to push this base into the future with the focus keeping the manufacturing here in Cleveland, sourcing it from the US, reducing the supply chain all while implementing new manufacturing Expanding hardware, software, and technology. I hope you all enjoy my conversation with Scott Colosimo. So I have been very much looking forward to to this conversation. I know we're we're going to be covering a lot here, multiple companies here in Cleveland.

Jeffrey Stern [00:02:53]:

But I'd love to start just setting the stage with a brief overview of of how you would describe Cleveland Cycle Works and how you would describe land energy. And really start with that context setting and and we'll we'll build from there.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:03:07]:

Sure. So to talk about Cleveland Cycle Works, I have to talk a little bit about my history and this sort of, like, wide eyed kid going into the auto industry. I almost feel like in school, you're being told that you could do anything you want. Right? Then you get put into this gigantic system that is the automotive industry and your ideas generally aren't that respected. Right? Cause you're just some stupid kid and, you know, you're talking $1,000,000,000 decisions. So you quickly find out either you're a lifer and you just deal with the drudgery of, you know, riding that, iceberg, or or you get sick and you leave. And, you know, Cleveland Cycle Works was very much my, like, middle finger to the car industry. Well, because I I got into it wanting to do everything.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:03:55]:

Right? Wanting to affect real change and it's like, well, just design gas Trucks or gas cars or design this handle or it is so I don't know. It was a it was a pretty big wake up call. So Cleveland Cycle Works was, like, Me kinda saying f it. I'm I'm gonna do this despite how you're supposed to do things. And, like any company. Right? It was a series of discoveries. So I started it really in the basement of Tektronic Industries, which owns, Dirt Devil and Hoover. And I used their entire shop and I was building motorcycles kind of I think it was, like, 5 PM till 2 AM every morning.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:04:35]:

Right? I was writing the business model and and doing all that and luckily enough, I got fired, about a year into that into into that that job. Right? We We had the, you know, our great recession. Right? 2008. Things really took a turn for the worse here. So I call it fired other people and say it laid off. So I think they laid off, like, 40% of their workforce? You know, they brought really, really smart people into Cleveland. That's what big corporations do. Right? They Concentrate a lot of smart people in one place.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:05:04]:

So all of a sudden, we found, there's about 40 really smart people that all got laid off at the same time. So we all started a a group licking our wounds, but, you know, you you a lot of good people you can't no one stays down for long. Right? So those that Quickly found other jobs, quickly found other jobs, and then all of us that were, like, alright. We're sick of getting screwed over by big corporations or, like, we're gonna do our own thing. So, like, literally, I remember I cobbled together this working prototype, rode it to one of our working drinking sessions that was at a bar in downtown Cleveland on a Thursday night, strategically positioned everyone outside and I rode the bike and parked it next to, you know, 30,000, $40,000 bikes And everyone was staring at this little, like, $3,000 bike that I built. And then I handed the business plan to everyone, I said, I'm doing this shit, Join me or don't. Of course, everyone's like, yeah, whatever. Proceed to get drunk.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:05:58]:

But then, the next morning, a few people called me and said, hey, we've been thinking about this. There's a story there. Right? Or at least there's a seed of an idea. And that was it. That's how it started. So it was like literally a few people believing in a really crazy idea, putting a little bit of planning behind it, and, you know, leading with design. That's really where Cleveland started. There's a a really, really long story there, but, basically, I tried for many months to start it here in the US.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:06:29]:

You know, at that time, I was in my early twenties and every factory I went to and I said, I'm starting a motorcycle manufacturer, they looked at me like and a few of them said, where's your dad? Where's Scott Colosimo? And I'm like, I'm him. And they're like, you know, get out of here. Like, who the hell are you? And after about 6 months of that, I was like, alright, I can't keep doing this. Right? Like, at that time, like, now keep in mind, we have to put this into context. That was like the height of offshoring. Right? That was every major US manufacturer was shipping it to China. So, at TTi, I made a ton of contacts And those who live this will truly understand what I mean when I say those are the MSN days, where you literally had a team of r and d people in the US, and then you had your Chinese team. And, at TTi, it's like, alright, before we left for the night, we got an MSN.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:07:19]:

We told them everything we needed to do. Sometimes we get on 2, 3 in the morning with China. Alright. They're doing it. They're working all night. We come in the morning, write our MSN's full of messages, and you keep working back and forth. So, you know, I already had that sort of infrastructure set up and then I had all these these Chinese folks I made contacts with saying, hey, fly to China. Come to China.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:07:40]:

Start your company in China. Mhmm. And I literally flew to China and I don't think I left for 2 years after that. And, you know, the The Chinese at that time were very entrepreneurial, very hungry. I call it an idea vacuum, but they had this incredible, manufacturing might. And every factory I walked into, they were saying, how do we partner? How do we do this? How do we get this to market? It was a totally different, experience. And I was sitting across the table from, you know, 24 year old multimillionaires running companies making millions of products a year. So It was a different dynamic and I totally embrace that.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:08:16]:

I said, okay, this is a place where I can I can grow my business? You know, but that was a different time. It was a different focus. But that's that's how it all started. Right? It was

Jeffrey Stern [00:08:25]:

And and that was back in 2009?

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:08:27]:

Yeah. So 2008 and then 2009 is when we really put a little bit of money behind it and tried to scale it. And then, you know, the Cleveland Cycle Works story is very much one of kind of American ingenuity and Chinese money, you know, being able to to do this. Now, look, it's There's a lot of lot of really bad shit that happened over 12 years. I mean, all of our intellectual property was stolen. Everything that people say don't go to China because this'll happen, it happened to us. You know, impossible to get money out of China. Like, we could literally ship we could send a wire transfer to the wrong factory, wrong bank account.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:09:03]:

It would still get to them. Right? But anytime we needed to get money out, it was like a a 3 to 4 week process. So, you know, it's very much a closed system. All the benefits are for the Chinese people, for the Chinese manufacturer, and all the crumbs are for any other partners. And this is a story repeated thousands and thousands and thousands of times. And, you know, we had some success. It afforded me a a nice kind of lifestyle business, but having all of our intellectual property stolen over and over and over again really starts to wear in you after a while.

Jeffrey Stern [00:09:37]:

Yeah. I can I can imagine?

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:09:39]:

Yeah. But, I mean, look at what we did. We were able to build a global lifestyle brand. Right? A a global manufacturing between company, essentially with other people's capital. Right? So there's a push pull there. Right? They invested in the company without having a, you know, equity stake, but they took that equity when they took our IP. So it's a give and take there. Right?

Jeffrey Stern [00:10:01]:

Right. Right. Kind of want to take 1 step back before, before we move forward is as someone who, who also rides a motorcycle. Something I've Come to learn is that everyone who rides, there's like the catalyst, some inspiration that inspired your your interest In motorcycles, and I'd love to hear just a little bit about, you know, what specifically drew you to to this world of of motorcycles and The business of it, and more generally, the the automotive space.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:10:30]:

Sure. So, you know, we all have that crazy uncle, or at least I hope everyone has a crazy uncle or a crazy aunt or, you know, that bad influence in your life. And, you know, I will say, I think there is something about vehicles that is literally it's in your DNA, it's in your blood. And I I firmly believe that because from 2 years old, I was on a pedal bike. You know, my aunt bought me a little still remember it. Fuzzy pink seat, red pedal bike. And at 2 years old, I was riding without training wheels ripping down the street? I just always wanted to be going faster and taking chances, and there was always there's something about being on 2 wheels and it it didn't have to have a motor. Right? So it started with a bicycle and my parents were very strict, so, and they were very clear.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:11:22]:

I was not allowed to have a motorcycle until I was out of their financial control. So that was always the the lever. Right? So I never had motorcycles until I was in college, but I was always borrowing friends mopeds, you know, my uncle's motorcycles and And my uncle was that Harley guy. Right? He was the dude that would always show up at the family functions on on bikes, and it was just so cool. There was something about it. So, you know, my love for bicycles translated to BMX bikes, and I spent my entire childhood building jumps and living in the woods and riding BMX bikes and, you know, traveling around. You know, Changa World was a big influence on that and amazing builders like Nate Wessel and, You know, people building amazing things for you to ride BMX bikes on, and then once I did get some money and graduated college, I had the ability to buy motorcycles and I got deep, deep, deep into racing? So, like, my baptism into motorcycles was late in life. Right? It was after college because My mom saw my uncle and my dad crashing motorcycles when they were growing up, so I was forbidden.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:12:28]:

Right? That was the the thing. So I actually think that the forbidden fruit makes it more attractive as well? Right? So, you know, there's always that, you can't do it while I'm gonna do it. And like I said, like, it it's really hard for me to explain to people who are just, like, it's just a car, or, it's just a bike, or, you know, like, I don't understand people who buy Honda Accords. Like, what? You know, like, Toyota Camry. Like, not even an option. Right? Like, transportation to me is transformative. Right? It's It's like an extension of your body. And even cars.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:13:02]:

Right? I've always been obsessed with cars as well. So it's hard to explain. So, You know, I you sent me some questions that, hey, I'm gonna ask this and I'm, like, I don't even know how to explain this obsession. I I'm trying to tease it out, but it's It's difficult.

Jeffrey Stern [00:13:16]:

Yeah. This is a good place to start.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:13:19]:

Well, it's a complete obsession. Right? Like, some people get addicted to drugs, Some people get addicted to other things. There's just something about putting your body in or on a vehicle. I mean, even Addiction with snowboarding. Right? It's a Mhmm. Things that move. It doesn't necessarily have to be a bike or a car. I think it's the the propulsion.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:13:40]:

The The speed is is something that that's there.

Jeffrey Stern [00:13:43]:

Yeah. No. It it resonates. But what I think maybe is not the case for most people is that It's hard to marry your passion, your obsession with being and an existing in the world and finding a way to To have a and earn a living through it. But you have you have found a way to to do this.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:14:03]:

It wasn't always that way. Know, there are many, many years where I spent my entire paycheck on my car. Right? Or I would lose girlfriends because I would be customizing my car in a body shop all night. Right? Like, I position like, so I worked in a body shop growing up, so I had access to tools so I could customize my car. Like, right? And even This move to TTi, when I saw their shop, I was like, alright. Well, I can work here designing vacuums and hand tools and stuff. But I'm like, I can use the shop to build motorcycles. Like, that was That was a main impetus.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:14:34]:

And I asked them straight up. I'm, like, can I use this to do my own stuff after hours? And they were, like, oh, yeah. Like, absolutely. So I, like, always kinda position myself in areas that I had access. And, you know, the the other thing is with BMX, we literally took woods that were trees and nothing in them. And I will say there's something about building trails in the woods. Like, people think it's just kids building mounds, but it's not. Like, We built trails and they flooded, so we had to irrigate them.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:15:02]:

Right? So we had to we buried, drainage tiles and we created ponds. And then those ponds got mosquitoes and we had to figure out ways to keep the mosquitoes away. And then, you know, you get bored with a line and you build transfers and, you know, and there was no one who was gonna do it unless you put in the time and the effort to do it. Right? So that sort of idea of I'm literally gonna spend 2 weeks building a a jump for my own enjoyment. Now, that builds this sort of steadfastness. Right? Like, it it doesn't happen overnight. It's very difficult. And the payoff is a very, very long payoff.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:15:35]:

So I think, you know, that sort of BMX culture, that community, and then, you know, out of that sprung a lot of businesses. Right? A lot of my friends started bike companies. They started parts companies. They became videographers, photographers, professional BMX riders. You know, Nate Wessel linked up with the, Nitro Circus guys in Woodward, and he's turned an entire career riding into a career building skate parks all around the world. So there's a lot of kind of entrepreneurship that came out of that, and it was just people trying to Live that high. Right? Follow that their passion. And I saw that from probably 7th grade on that, you know, these were young guys following their passions? I mean, Changa World was a couple 20 year old starting a skate park.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:16:23]:

Right? Like, Insane. So, you know, Cleveland's like that. Right? It's, it's not a place that you're you floss without substance right here. If you're If you're a baller, it's a baller because you you made it, you built it. It's different.

Jeffrey Stern [00:16:38]:

Yeah. That's very cool. Before we kinda work our way Towards land energy and and talk about the work you're doing there. I love to just get, you know, an understanding of where where Cycle Works is today. And One thing I just wanted to go a little bit deeper on was your perspective on on leading with design as as kind of the The founding for it.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:17:01]:

Sure. Yeah. So Cleveland Cycle Works to just to kinda drive home what that brand and company is, I saw the entire industry making cheap, really crappy bikes as a means to step people up into 15 and $20,000 bikes. Right? They treated you like, oh, poor you, you working class slob. Here's a pretty shitty bike, but, oh, we'll get you into that $15,000 bike. Know, we'll build your credit. It was like a it was a really poor business model to me. Right? And it's so salient at this point that I saw A company I really admired called Sucker Punch Sally's, back in the day, offering what they called the working man's bobber, which I think was, like, 15 to $17,000 for a pile of parts that you had to build yourself? And I was, like, what working man is that for? Because that is not a single working man I know.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:17:50]:

Right? And that was it. And I said, look, I wanna build really cool, affordable bikes. So we did bikes that were 27100 to $6,000, that you can be proud to ride. And if you ride a Cleveland Cycleworks bike anywhere and you stop at a gas station, you cannot get out of that gas station without someone saying, that's cool, want to know more, or asking you where you got it. And that's the power of design. Right? It wasn't this, oh, poor you, you can only afford a a cheap bike. It was, like, no, own it. Like, affordability is cool.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:18:21]:

Right? I'm living within my means and I have this amazing platform to do that and customization was always in the back of our minds as well. And, You know, this idea of, you know, sticking $10,000 of chrome on a $30,000 bike was really foreign to me. So I said, okay. Well, you can completely kit one of our bikes out for $1,000. And I'm talking a really slick custom. So for, you know, under $5, you can have a pretty awesome custom bike. And that was it. And it was all led by design.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:18:52]:

Right? The choices we made, we we went with the 2 50 cc to start with, then a 400 c c, and, we have some bigger motors, but it was all just squarely looking at where I saw the consumer, where I saw a need, and just want to make cool products for what I think are pretty cool people. And and that's really all it was. So now we talk about the transition to land, energy, and, you know, my My life, my career has been very much of, like, trying to plan it out, but you can never really like, I can't plan 2 days from now, let alone years in the future. So We started doing, the Falcon, which was our 1st e bike under Cleveland Cycle Works. We knew nothing about electric. Right? We started building custom bikes and just literally playing around with electric on our spare time, and, like, designers often do And this is what I can never do in the auto industry. We dug deeper and we kept digging and then digging. And we continue to dig.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:19:51]:

And what we found is that the deeper we got into electric, the less value we saw in gas. And at least from an innovation standpoint, which I'm always pushing for innovation, I came to an absolute end with with gasoline as an innovator. Once I understood the benefits from a manufacturing standpoint, from a a user standpoint, and from a a more global standpoint, I lit I could not bring myself to design any more gas bikes. Now, I have to separate myself as a business person from myself as an enthusiast. Right? I still love a v eight. I love electric propulsion. Give me a jet engine. I'll love that too.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:20:34]:

Right? To me, it it wasn't so much about the means as an enthusiast. It was about how this transition happened as a as an innovator. And Cleveland Cycle Works after that, after I transitioned and then my guys slowly transitioned, you know, our engineers and designers and everyone here, we're looking at each other like, what the hell are we doing? So there's still a market for gas. I mean, there's gonna be, You know, probably a 10 to 12, maybe 13 year transition. There's still markets where gas bikes continue to grow. Right? Southeast Asia is seeing a massive increase in the middle class, so, you know, the 400 cc bike is a big growth market because everyone's stepping up from the 250. So Cleveland Cycle Works still has legs. It can still grow.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:21:20]:

It can still expand. I'm sure anyone buying it's probably gonna eventually do electric. But, you know, we have 7 gas vehicles that exist, a ton of IP, 1,000,000 of dollars in tooling, so I'm in the process of selling it. You know, as a CEO, I can't head a company that I don't want to continue to scale. Right? So there's a story there. There's a future there. There's there's currently several buyers for the company. You know, that transition process is slow.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:21:51]:

We just signed up a new distributor today in Malaysia. So there there's still growth, and and there's still people that believe in and are invested in the Cleveland Cycle Works brand. It's just as an innovator, I can't do that and then also push the electric forward. So I had to make a a break and it was hard because we went from, you know, the Cleveland Cycle Works revenue was funding all of the early land development. But at some point, I I just had to make, had to make that mental shift and say, okay, that was the past. The future is the future. You know, the deeper we went into it, and that's where, you know, like Harley Davidson, they're trying to hold onto this heritage. And when we do market research, the tech forward people that are interested in what we're doing, they don't care about heritage.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:22:38]:

So Cleveland Cycle Works is more of an encumbrance then, you know, we originally thought, okay, well, people are gonna see what we did with Cleveland and that's gonna help really propel the electric bikes forward. It had the opposite effect. A lot of people were really turned off by that, that heritage and that kind of old school motorcycle branding.

Jeffrey Stern [00:23:01]:

Yes. Yes.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:23:02]:

So we just had to make a complete break and say, okay, where are we going with it? And, you know, Cleveland Cycle Works, we just shorten that to land. And it it's very much a hat tip to the city that we love, you know. Yeah. I think Namesake of this podcast. The land. That's right. So it was a process. Right? You can't plan a lot of this stuff out.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:23:26]:

And the the more we learn and and the deeper we get, the more relevant it is

Jeffrey Stern [00:23:30]:

becoming. So what did you unearth as you kept digging? Like, what is the land?

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:23:36]:

So land, as a company, our reason for being is what we call power continuity. Power continuity or distributed power is a very new concept. As any business person, if you really, So what I'll I'll say is my transition from, kind of, designer to entrepreneur, it's taken a 10 to 12 years to really Stop thinking myself as purely a designer and give up that in in culture design and other people. Right? Designers, people may or may not know. It's like the most competitive field in the world? Like, less people get hired as car designers than get into the NFL. This is a fact. Right? So it's very, very competitive, and it's a lot of type a's, and it's a lot of, We're we're a damage set. So in a good way.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:24:23]:

Right? It's kind of a lot of compulsive nature there. But I transitioned that love of design and love of of creating and innovating to bringing that love to innovating from a business model standpoint. So we gotta tease out how it how it started. Right? So it started making cool little ebikes. Then we understand, well, These have electric batteries. Why is everyone ignoring the fact that these can literally power everything? And then looking at the whole industry and say, Well, the industry is really trying to do motorcycle 2 point o. Right? So if if you're running a gas business and you own, let's say, 50% of the motorcycle market, you don't want change. Changes a a direct threat to your entire business model.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:25:05]:

So, you know, the entire industry right now is trying to convince consumers that it still makes sense to buy gas, while then trying to convince them to buy electric, which is very difficult. So they're doing electric bikes that look like gas bikes, you know, a la the LiveWire. Right? Let's make a a really big heavy gas bike and let's just make this electric. And then let's put some buzzwords around it and, know, try to make it vibrate and it's like the antithesis of what we don't wanna do. It's this, hold on to the heritage while try to Embrace the future. It's very difficult. So we got into it and we said, okay. There's this power platform that's different.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:25:41]:

It doesn't have to be static. It doesn't have to be Structural. It's the thing that's changing the most. Right? It's, battery power, battery investment, and what we're finding with, different cell technologies is scaling so quickly? So we latched onto that and we didn't know where it was gonna go. We said, there's something there we don't quite know. And we put that to the side and and then we started developing what we call the Emoto. And then we started looking at the bike and say, okay, where's the low hanging fruit? What's missing? Where electrification to us makes more sense, small displacement gas vehicles, because all the ethanol mandates and everything that all the stuff that's going into gas right now, it makes them very difficult to to use, especially in Cleveland where if the storm for a few months, you know, ethanol evaporates, and then you got a clogged injector, clogged carbs. So on the small end, let's call it, 50 cc to, like, 400 cc, we see real benefit to electrification.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:26:42]:

On the higher end, trying to compete with, you know, a 190 horsepower, gas motorcycle, that's where electric doesn't do so well. And then anything above, like, 65 miles per hour, It's just killing the battery. Right? It's it's pulling so much energy out of the battery that we said there's there's no benefit there. So first and foremost, we looked at, okay, there's something with the the power. Mhmm. We gotta hit the right product. Right? We wanna offer more usability, more benefit to the consumer. So let's stick with this like 50 to 400 CC range.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:27:14]:

And that was it. That was the seed. Where it transitioned into was these power packs can be swapped out, You can use them as battery backup for your house. If you go camping, you can use the 2nd pack to, power Anything. Your computer, you know, we put an inverter in it. It's got USB A, USB C connections. So power your cell phones. You can plug in LED lights And then you add solar to that and that's kinda where the light bulb went on.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:27:43]:

And once we started charging these packs off the grid, That's where we said, while there is really we're right at the cusp of something big here. Batteries to most consumers are boring. Right? They're static. There's not a lot there. So we've kinda landed in this really good place where the Emoto is literally a power distribution device. We take this very serious. We put a lot of time and effort into developing this chassis, the platform, the vehicle, our algorithms and all the the data and everything behind that, our IoT package. But then we started looking at, well, where else can this go? And then all of a sudden, we had RV companies contacting us and saying, well, Could this be used? Charge it off as some solar and could we use your 5 kilowatt hour packs as is our battery system for the RV? And we said, well, yeah.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:28:34]:

Why not? You could. And we started looking at that and say, well, a lot of RV people like to put bikes on the back of of your RV. I'm one of them. I I'm an active RV and camper. Mhmm. And we started saying, well, you know, more and more RV's are coming with solar panels on the roof, so you can Power your RV off the grid now. Right? Charge it with a generator if you need to, and you can keep the RV parked. And now you have a vehicle that you can run around the campground, you can go off roading, you can run to the store, and you can simply swap packs out, and you always have a charge pack to go.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:29:08]:

Then we dug deeper, we started getting contacted by companies that are doing fleet vehicles. And they said, well, can we keep the fleet running, virtually, 247 and just swap out the packs? And we said, well, absolutely. That's a there's an option there. And then we dug deeper and said, we had People contacting us saying, hey, could we just buy the power platform and squeeze it for other things? Which, you know, we're seeing there's there's other companies doing batteries and we said, well, that's not too big of a stretch. Sure. You could do that. And then we design the whole vehicle ecosystem around what we call these core packs. So these packs fit into all of our vehicles.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:29:42]:

Right? And and I think that's, you know, this idea of this ecosystem or this complete kind of breaking free the power from the vehicle, being able to remove it, letting it live with you. Right? You can leave the bike on the street and pull the power up to your apartment, plug it in. They plug into any standard outlet And and there was something there. So from the consumer, you know, and there's 2 different paths that we're going right now. There's the consumer facing and then there's kind of the investor or our internal vision. And those 2 never quite especially in startups, they never live together. Right? Because As we're talking vision, we're talking big ideas. We're talking about who we want to be or where we're going in 2, 3, 5 years.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:30:25]:

So we have to make sure that we get that consumer voice right. We understand where we're at now versus where we're going. So where we are now, we're Kind of bikes and batteries. Right? That's the that's what we're doing. Bikes and batteries. The batteries Yeah. Power the bike and they also power some of your, your devices? Where we're going, though, is much, much bigger than that. And we keep getting asked by investors, like, hey, do you see a day where you Might not do bikes and that that might be reality.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:30:54]:

But right now, we're really, really focused on the bikes and the batteries.

Jeffrey Stern [00:30:59]:

Yeah. And I'll just add as, like, commentary here. I came across one of your bikes here in the wild recently here in Cleveland. And it is it's like it's visually striking aesthetically. Like, it does not look like anything that you have seen, like, out there before in terms of just the lines, the the cleanliness of it. And it it it does inspire, like, you were mentioning with with Cycleworks, but it inspires a conversation to go, like, hey, like, what is this thing? And Where where do you get it and and what what's what's the story behind it?

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:31:37]:

Well, that's usually what happens. That usually exactly what you said is the what we hear. What is this thing? That is usually how it starts. And this conversation happens everywhere we go and, You know, I forget that part of it. Design is so baked into everything we do that we often forget how unique it is. I think we need to talk about what design is to us. Because a lot of people think design is just what it looks like. And that is a big part of it.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:32:04]:

Right? I've always lived by this motto of it's easier to sell something that you don't have to sell, right? If the product is visually striking, if it's made with quality if you can see a certain craftsmanship. And if it visually communicates a certain a motion, it it's just easy to to sell a product like that because you're not trying to sell somebody. You're just putting it out there and saying, you either like it or you don't. Right? It's simple. So the design has been something, visually that we have been very, very focused on. And, you know, it's a fine balance because If you make it too much of a spaceship, there's a massive acceptance curve, right? You don't wanna be on that bleeding edge, you know, unless you have 100 of 1,000,000 of dollars, which we don't. So it's this It has to inspire confidence. Right? It has to be intriguing.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:32:57]:

It's often a little abrasive to some people, but it it has to elicit some emotion. And I think that's what our our first vehicle does and We have a few other vehicles in the works that, we believe will do that as well. So at the core, visually striking is important, but design to us is Very simple. Does it offer something better than something that exists? We ask ourselves that every day is, Is it doing something better? Does it offer the consumer something in addition to and if it doesn't, it's a product we don't release or it's a feature that we don't add on. And, you know, tech for tech's sake, or this idea of releasing tech onto the market with no discernible user benefit. It's something that a lot of companies get trapped into. Right? Like, I have a GE washing machine that is it's a connected IoT device, and is absolutely worthless. Like, all it basically does is text me when the wash is done.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:33:56]:

It doesn't offer me any benefit. It's tech for tech's sake. Like, Okay. If I could put the dryer on and keep it from wrinkling, now that would be a benefit. Right? It doesn't do that. So, you know, we're we're very clear about this. Like, If it doesn't offer a benefit, don't just don't do it. And it's a very, I would say, honest way of of looking at a product.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:34:15]:

And Our our product is not the flashiest. It is not the most tech laden product in the world. You know, the the The thing I keep telling my guys is there are other companies that have amazing tech packages, but the product is garbage. And we've ridden them, and we've used them, And it seems like 90% of the focus is on the app, which by the way, once an apps out, you can update it. Right? If you get the hardware wrong, There there's no turning back if you screw the hardware up. So we're very focused on that whole, get the hardware right. You've gotta get that right at the very beginning. You have to test it.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:34:52]:

You have to make sure that it's solid and it's exactly what it needs to be. The software updates we can send. We can over the air update them. So, where's our focus? Well, the focus is is hardware, batteries, right? It's doing what Cleveland does. It's building stuff. And then the the tech is is building as we're we're learning more and more.

Jeffrey Stern [00:35:11]:

Yeah. There's a few threads I I wanna pull on there. I guess the first is kind of referring back to something you had mentioned in your own transition to innovation and design, to innovation in the business itself. When you think about innovation in in manufacturing and the work you're doing here, I'd love to just understand how you're thinking about, Maybe even relative to what you had done prior with Cycleworks, what does that look like in terms of supply chain, manufacturing, You know, implementing new techniques, geographically, how you're thinking about that that whole process.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:35:48]:

Sure. I I think that's important to to talk about as well. What I wanted to do with Cleveland Cycle Works was build an American manufactured product. I would have fallen on my sword if I would have followed that path in 2009. There was absolutely no interest in what we were doing back then. And what do you need to do as you're growing, you know, what what we're called as an OEM. So we're an original equipment manufacturer. Right? We're a vehicle manufacturer.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:36:13]:

We cannot do it on our own. We need suppliers to build our company. Now we're vertically integrating a ton and that's not meaning that you don't, but you work with? For example, we've never made a brake caliper. There are companies that just make brake calipers. There are thousands of them in China. There's a bunch in Italy. There's a few in the US. When we were starting off, there were no brake caliper manufacturers in the US who would even talk to us.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:36:38]:

We had meetings with The few motor manufacturers here, they wouldn't they didn't care about what we were doing. Right? They had their own thing. So not having any support from the supplier base made it very difficult to try to do that here. Mhmm. What we found in 2020, though, is this real sense of, Holy shit. We literally shipped everything to China, and we cannot make anything here, and we can't get anything. You know what? COVID completely broke this fallacy of the global supply chain. And, you know, for for 12 years, I could order parts from our supplier, and I could spin out my factories, and we had an endless supply of raw materials, 10 to 15 days.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:37:19]:

We can make parts and build bikes and, literally, have bikes shipped within 45 days? 45 days was a disaster. 15 to 30 days was average for us. So think about that. We get a container order. We're just in timing, Small volume, you know, 50 to a 150 bikes in 15 to 20 days. Like, that was that was common. We did that for 12 years. COVID hits.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:37:41]:

You can't get raw materials. You can't get anything shipped. You know, I can't forever shipping containers were, You know, 3 grand to 32100 average to ship them across the world. You know, now we're seeing like $12,000 shipping containers. So The the supply chain was broken. So we looked at this and we said, holy shit, now's our time. It's like, now is our time to to do what we wanted to do. And then, you know, all these advocacy networks in Ohio started to talk exactly like We needed them to talk.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:38:14]:

Right? Supply chain's broke, we need to bring back manufacturing. And, actually, the biggest impetus is this transition from gas to electric. I'm not gonna name our supplier, but we went to 1 supplier that's making a ton of automotive exhaust components. Mhmm. And we walked in there and we said, what are you gonna do when everything transitions to electric? Like, 80% of your business is making exhausts. And the manufacturer kinda chuckled, and he's like, come on, man. He's like, we're making millions of these things. The weekend went by.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:38:44]:

Monday morning, he called us. He said, hey, why don't you come by? Let's talk. And we said, okay. Yeah. Great. They had all the all the tooling, all the machinery we needed to make certain components. And he said, you know, I've been so focused on next week, 2 weeks from now, getting these parts out? He's like, I never really thought about 5 years from now. And often, this is the manufacturing story.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:39:04]:

Right? You're trying to Just, you're focused on building things. And he said, you're right. He goes, I went and researched this. And he goes, literally, every major manufacturer, automotive manufacturers announced that they're on a 5 to 10 year journey to get out of gas completely. And I'm, like, yeah, dude. I'm like, where have you been? And he's like, I've been making things. He's like, I've been making stuff. He's like, what do you mean where have I been? He's like, every day I'm grinding.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:39:29]:

And and that's the opportunity we we needed. And he said, alright. He goes, let's let's take a chance. He goes, I know you're a startup. I know you have no money, But he's like, I'm I'm getting into electric. He's like, let's do it. Let's do it together. It's so different from from 2009 to to 2020.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:39:45]:

The amount of support in this realization that if we don't do something in the US, we're not gonna have any jobs. We're not gonna be able to get anything. You know, national national security is at risk. So that was the impetus. And and really what it is is I think it's this coming together of industry. It's the coming together of the government, You know, like it or hate it if we don't improve our electric infrastructure, you know, if we don't build, if we don't Start making aluminum and steel and and all those things here again. If we don't start building things, all is lost. I mean, you know, that's a that's a big part of it.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:40:19]:

So, You know, if if you ask, you know, pull pull that thread a little bit, we are nothing. Right? We're a teeny little startup. And there are massive, massive Corporations here in the US that we're partnering with and some small, some some big, but there is this collective right now that I've never seen. It's, Alright. We're we're gonna get back to what America does and we're gonna start building stuff.

Jeffrey Stern [00:40:44]:

And it's it's very cool to to hear. The the other thread I wanted to pull on that, you talked about was kind of around the competitive landscape here. You know, you mentioned you have You've kind of tried what is out there, maybe differences in in the philosophy around what electric vehicles are and should be. But I'd I'd love to just get your perspective on on how you think about differentiation and competitors in the market, both on I think you've touched Kind of on the difference between traditional motorcycles and and what you're trying to do, but but really just kinda the the overall take on on the market.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:41:21]:

Sure. Let me mention one more thing. I I realized I didn't answer your question about about why US manufacturing. Yeah. So the advanced manufacturing that we're seeing right now, especially on small volume, which, you know, till we're producing millions of units, we are a small volume manufacturer. Sure. So we're seeing advancements in laser cutting, CNC bending, you know, even laser coping on tubing, robot welding, cobots and robots. We're literally 3 d printing continuous strand carbon fiber parts for our drive train that we're able to test.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:41:56]:

So this idea of advanced US manufacturing, we've seen, within 5 years, it become a tool in the design studio And it's starting to transition to real life applications. I remember going to, factories in the US 10 years ago? Okay. We just got a brand new, you know, fiber laser cutter $1,000,000. I have friends in Cleveland that are running their tire operation off of an $80,000 laser cutter? The cost of of some of these advanced tools that were astronomical just a few years ago, have become realistic for small volume manufacturers to bring in house and do and actually run your operation off. So This idea of advanced US manufacturing is something that we are fully embracing, and it's the only way that we see that we will be competitive globally.

Jeffrey Stern [00:42:48]:

Mhmm. And

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:42:49]:

if you look at it, I mean, I have spent 10 years of my life in factories. Right? Where, you know, there's workers welding with Cardboard masks with, like, a a hand cut out shield for their eyes. Right? Or everything from The craziest, like, dirt floor factories to the most advanced factories that are running, you know, complete cycles of of robots feeding their assembly lines with parts. Right? I've I've I've seen the gamut of it. Up until recently, these advanced tools that the big manufacturers were were using that were so far out of reach. That's where the US is right now and I I will say that The kind of workers that we're attracting are interested in manufacturing, but they're not interested in sitting at a stamping machine and and having a repetitive job all day. They're interested in advanced manufacturing. Working on CNC machines, you know, working with cobots, advanced assembly, And and that's where we see our future.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:43:45]:

So, you know, when people think manufacturing, this isn't the way it was in the 1900. Right? Where you're in a dirty factory, doing a repetitive job all day. We see our future firmly rooted in advanced manufacturing And Ohio, specifically, is a huge, huge supporter of that. Okay. So wanted to just cover that real quick.

Jeffrey Stern [00:44:07]:

Yeah. No. I I appreciate that.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:44:09]:

Yeah. So so we answered that. So now, the the other thread you wanted me to pull was around kind of, the product. Right?

Jeffrey Stern [00:44:17]:

Yeah. Yeah.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:44:18]:

So this is just thinking like a designer thinks. I've seen a lot of companies that release product without thinking of the market or thinking about where the white space is. And we just saw a product launch today that we were freaked out about? We're like, oh, this big company getting into new product, and we watched the product relief and we all laughed. We're like, okay, this is a joke. Because it's a they're launching to a space that makes no sense to us. Right? It might make sense to them, but we're looking at saying, where's the white space? Like, where do where can you lead? And and that's a big focus. Right? It's where can we make a real mark and and really affect a a change? I'll give you a a realistic Look at that. So between 5 to 7% of the US own and and ride a motorcycle.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:45:07]:

Right? It's a very, very small segment. So if I'm a major OEM, I'm gonna say, okay, well, you know, let's capture more of the adventure bike segment. You know, let's capture more of the street bike segment or let's step these people up from our scooters into our our big bikes. Right? That's that's how how you're looking at it. We looked at it with, Well, why aren't people riding? Like, what are the barriers to entry to riding a motorcycle? And then we made a vehicle that is a bicycle. That same vehicle without changing any components is also a moped, and that same vehicle without changing any components is also a motorcycle. And we do it through, software, right, we're we're able to, physically manipulate the actual performance, the power output of the vehicle to where it meets 3 different criteria, defined by FMVSS and DOT. So we're making 1 vehicle that can be Both a bicycle, moped, or a motorcycle.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:46:06]:

And then the traditional motorcyclist comes here and says, well, this is stupid. It doesn't have clutch? Right? Or this is goofy. It doesn't have a a break, where my right foot should be. And We're saying, well, it doesn't have those things because those are barriers to entry and we didn't see any benefit in that. So why would we put a clutch on the bike, and put gears if there's no benefit? And why would we put a a foot actuated break when there's no need or no benefit? This thing rides like a bicycle. And those same people that were motorcycle riders, we give them the bike for a day and we said, spend a day with it. And at the end of the day, you still desire to have a clutch and you still desire to have a break? Tell us. But but be be honest about if you really want it or don't.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:46:54]:

And luckily, about 99% of the people bringing the bike back say, yeah, I don't miss anything. It didn't add anything to the experience. So it's just Something they're used to. Right? Like a real motorcycle has to have a clutch and you have to shift gears. It and once you just evaluate the product and say, okay, well, that keeps people out. Right? That we've all seen videos of, you know, people whiskey throttling it into a barn or into the side of a car like, you know, uncontrollably wheeling a dirt bike? Those are barriers to entry. It's scary. Right? It's it's a scary thing.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:47:25]:

You know, our ride mode 1, it's limited to 25 miles per hour? And no matter what you do, 1 finger on the brake will stop the bike. So if you accidentally whiskey throttle, which you Cannot, because it's so soft. But even so, if if you're on that throttle and you need to stop, put 1 finger on either brake and and the bike's coming to a stop. So, you know, when I say we're trying to solve issues and and give the consumer more, this stems from the very core on how the software and acts with the hardware to, like, what you mentioned, how the vehicle looks. Right? The the physical presence of the vehicle.

Jeffrey Stern [00:48:04]:

How do you think about affordability? You've kind of touched on the ethos, I think, but specifically with this product.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:48:11]:

Sure. So, you know, there's good and bad. We have enough manufacturing experience to be dangerous, But I don't think we've been in the industry too long to say, well, that's the way you do things, which we see every day. Right? Well, that's not a that's not the way you do a bike or that's not the way you do it. And it's like, well, why do you do it that way? So we were able to hit are MSRP, that we launched at. So the bike starts at $8,000, the district, and it goes up to 15,000. Now, a lot of people mistook this $15,000 version as our production version. It it's a bespoke hand built CNC vehicle.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:48:54]:

We're only building 20 of them and and they're sold out. So, you know, this is where you gotta love the press when they report land making a $15,000 bike. We call it the founder's edition because the people that ordered that bike helped us found the company. Right? These were early believers in what we were doing. They put some money down and it helps seed the company to grow it. And they're getting a very special, hand numbered, one of a kind. The first 20 bikes are going into the hands of of those consumers. The more production focused version, however, is $8,000.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:49:26]:

If you look at what we are providing for $8,000, It is the most compelling package out there, and I don't think other companies could do what we're doing for the price we're doing at. The kind of power that the vehicle has, 500, foot pounds of torque. It has a single, 1.8 kilowatt hour battery. You can upgrade that to a dual, which is 3.6 kilowatt hours. Our single, core plus battery is, 5 kilowatt hours. We're using braided and bonded stainless steel lines. The brakes are Magura, so one of the best brake manufacturers in the world. We've partnered with Fox.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:50:05]:

We have the world's 1st production air shock on the bike. So it's, you know, this kind of innovation stems it goes through the whole vehicle. So the the product that we're releasing, there's nothing like this on the market, and there there's nothing quite like the quality. And it's almost like a bespoke custom bike, at a at a bargain price. Right? So that there's a tremendous value there. Now we understand $8,000, it's a lot of money. Right? That's a big chance to take on a start up. And we get that.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:50:38]:

And we do have less expensive vehicles planned, and we do have, less expensive version of this vehicle that we're gonna be releasing as well. But, you know, our goal is to produce a good quality, good cost bike. Some of our competitors are producing cheap bikes. Right? And what does cheap mean? Cheap means there's no product support. You can't get parts. Every 2 years, they're making a new vehicle, so They're expecting you to throw it away and and get a new one. To to create good quality, good cost, there's a back end cost to that. Right? We have to keep parts in stock.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:51:11]:

We have to treat the customer right. Right? We have to support the product with, maintenance. We have to offer warranty. We have to be there to answer questions, so we need support staff. So to us, value in in this idea of good quality, good cost, it's it's holistic. It isn't just about buying this bike and and that's it because, inevitably, you're gonna buy a product and something is going to go wrong eventually and you are going to need to talk to someone or email someone and and and get some support. So, You know, that kind of permeates through the entire core of what we're doing here. And I would not be doing this at this time anywhere else in the US because the whole supply chain and this whole value chain of what we're trying to do, it's really supported here right now.

Jeffrey Stern [00:51:59]:

Here in Cleveland?

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:52:01]:

Yeah. I mean, not just Cleveland. Like, we have Wisconsin. We're working with manufacturing in Wisconsin, you know, Mansfield, you know, Southern Ohio, we do have a few suppliers in, the EU. But in in general, You know, we're building out the factory here. We're we're doing about 80% of the parts in Ohio, which is great. We're building the chassis in house. We're vertically integrating.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:52:25]:

So, yeah, I would say Ohio, US, in in general. Is it gonna be that way forever? No. You know, there's some places that you can't export US product to. You know, there's a lot of protectionism going on outside the US. So we can't ship bikes to India. We cannot ship bikes to China. We can't Ship bikes to Southeast Asia. But we're looking inward.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:52:43]:

Right? We're we're starting to grow sales and starting to grow the company. It's really a US focus right now.

Jeffrey Stern [00:52:50]:

Before we kinda transition back to Cleveland and and, some of the closing questions I have, I do wanna just understand how You are thinking about the transition from this Emoto ecosystem, the the core, the the vehicle itself to from a business to the broader energy vision that you have for for distribution of energy? I'd love to just understand how you're you're thinking about that.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:53:17]:

Sure. So the next 12 months are focused on, like I said, bikes and batteries. Right? So the Yeah. The near term is bikes and batteries. The great thing about having swappable batteries is, yeah. That's one thing you'll notice on our website. We don't talk about sustainability Because, again, it has to be built in. Right? It has to be ground up.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:53:36]:

So sustainability to us isn't buying a product that's gonna be thrown away in 2 years. So the idea with the batteries being swappable is also an idea of keeping the main component, the vehicle on the road. And let's say you sell this bike in 5 years, a new consumer owns it and we've seen tremendous increases in battery technology, you simply swap in new battery tech, that old battery tech comes out and we can use it for battery backups. Right? We can we can still use that technology and you have a vehicle that was not thrown away, you have a vehicle that can live many lives. So a big part of the scale of the company is having these Emotos on the road. And the more Emotos we put out there, it creates an annuity, for us, and it it creates some real value for the consumer because we can always be offering them the newest tech. So that is a big part of of the plan, but outside of of the vehicle, we see a tremendous opportunity for battery backup in the home. We've had a few investors who we're looking at Tesla Powerwalls and the cost to install those is it's significant.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:54:48]:

And It assumes that you own a house. It assumes that you're gonna be in that house for at least 8 to 10 years, and there's a lot of infrastructure changes you need to do to to integrate that. We're offering a way for people to get into energy independence and battery backup at a very low cost and it's mobile. So if you don't own a a house, you have a battery backup system that goes with you. The fact that we're focused on these smaller 1.8 kilowatt hour to 5 kilowatt hour packs means that you can actually charge them off of solar. So let's say, and anyone who lives in Cleveland Heights knows the issue with Cleveland Heights. Our power goes down once a week, like, religiously. We're always out of power.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:55:31]:

Yeah. You know, these things aren't made to have battery backup in your house for weeks. It's emergency. Right? Okay. I need to do some work. I have no power. I could work for a couple hours or a few days. I could plug in a refrigerator, you know, keep my refrigerator running or, like, a plug in a router.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:55:47]:

Right? It's it's a more mobile solution and it's not static. And that's kind of the main focus. You're going camping for the weekend, throw it in your car, take the bike with you or don't. You you know, this idea of power continuity became very clear to us because of COVID. You know, I have 4 kids, and sometimes you just can't work with 4 kids in the house. It's insane. So I would have to go to the park. It just just to be able to think.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:56:14]:

Right? And I could work for 45 minutes and then have to charge my go back and charge my computer. And I was, like, you know what? Actually, Henry chopped one of our engineers chopped up the 1st connectivity device that had a inverter and USB chargers? And I was sitting at the park bench and I had our bike. I had our battery on the table. My iPhone was plugged in to the pack and then my computer was plugged in to the AC inverter and I spent 8 hours at the park. And that's when I said, holy shit. This was not possible before and I didn't have to worry about running back to my house, like I had to do for the couple months prior, you know, like, 45 minutes of work, it it just wasn't enough. And then we hired some photographers and we started doing video shoots, and we started to do 5 to 6 hours of video shoots and we would charge all of the batteries for the cameras off of the bikes. We started doing really high res photos and videos and then we started to pull the packs out and the tethers for the computer, you know, computers were running out of power, we were running those off the bikes as well.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:57:21]:

We went up camping in Virginia, Boulder Mountain, and I just had a pack sitting next to the fire, so I could work, you know, 12 to 2 AM when everyone's sleeping? I had to you know, if you're an entrepreneur, you can never really take off. So but, you know, that's my lifestyle. Right? I, I go out and I enjoy, and then at at night, I have to do a few hours of work and I didn't have to recharge the battery for the whole week I was there. I was able to charge my computer, my phone, and and I was able to work at night. So this idea of power continuity, it's the way that we all live our lives here. There's not very many days where we're disconnected. And I I can't say who it is, but literally tomorrow, we have an RV company flying to Cleveland to meet with us about, well, what could we do in the RV industry? Right? What could we do with these these swappable power packs in RV's? And then we kind of briefly talked about fleets, right, there's some fleet opportunities there. You know, if you're Amazon Or we you've I'm sure even people that aren't in the industry, you've heard of this last mile.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:58:23]:

Right? Well, last mile is also an issue for delivery. So instead of having a gigantic electric box truck that's going into New York City, you could have microhubs and you have a fleet of ebicycles with swappable packs that can be running all day if need be. So if you look outside the vehicle, there's a lot of opportunity with the outdoor in the RV community. There is a need for overlanders, you know, people who are doing rooftop tents in Jeeps and Tacomas to have a separate electrical system from their, start system that starts the car. We've heard stories of people getting stranded by accidentally draining their car's battery. You know, I'm just gonna plug in for a minute, you fall asleep, and then you can't start it, which if you're over landing is quite dangerous. Most people have Overlanders are very smart people though, so most of them have some sort of backup. But in terms of tent camping, there's there's some opportunities.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [00:59:23]:

We've been contacted by quite a few RV companies that are Trusted in, the distributed power. Like the one thing I I'm seeing it on the road too, is more and more people are putting ebikes on the back of their RVs. So this idea of having an integrated system, a scalable system is attractive. There's some opportunities, obviously, with the Defense space. So there's a ton of opportunity on that side. And there's a lot of infrastructure opportunities. So there's, you know, people build building, you know, off the grid systems. We were talking to a specific, organization that has weather stations that are, solar and and run off of batteries.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:00:02]:

So there's there's a lot of opportunity out there. We are focused on, Again, going back to our focus, bikes and batteries. That's that's right now. You know, the low hanging fruit is, like, what b to b opportunities exist, who is trying to get into the space, and, who can we partner with to to expand upon that? And that, you know, probably be the the next area that we venture into? And there's there's a lot of opportunity there. And it's exciting because when we started to tease this out and talk to people, At first, it was like, well, who the hell needs this? Like, what is, like, what is this? But the more people that use the product, or go camping or spend times outdoors or or try to work outside the office, the more people are coming back to us and saying, okay, well, we we see the need. We get it. Like, there's a there's an opportunity here. And that's exciting.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:00:51]:

It's it's exciting when other people start to kinda see and validate what what we're seeing.

Jeffrey Stern [01:00:56]:

It is, and it's an exciting vision. It's it's an exciting product. It's very it's very cool what what you guys are building over there.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:01:03]:

We're we're having fun. Right? That's kinda what it's all about right now.

Jeffrey Stern [01:01:07]:

That's that's important too. It's, that's an important part of the process. So I I wanna tie it back to to Cleveland as we wrap up here, which we've touched on quite quite a bit over, the conversation. I wanted to get your perspective on startups and on building a company here in Cleveland.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:01:29]:

You know, I think the probably the best asset we have is cheap real estate. I don't know why anybody would put a startup in in any ZIP code in California? Makes no sense to me. The real estate, the cost to compete with the Googles and the the Valley, is astronomical. And, yes, there is a ecosystem there, but from a startup perspective, it's very, very expensive. So, this idea of bootstrapping, you know, faking it till you make it, it's very, very difficult. And we've seen a lot of companies have Pretty quick scale ups and then and then fall. There is $2 a square foot space here in Cleveland. Like, that's insane.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:02:08]:

You know, there's $4 a square foot space and there's $22 a square foot space. Pick pick where you wanna be. Right? And then Cleveland's a city of people that build things and we have a culture of there's not a kind of an uppity ness here. Right? There's not this sort of Fakeness. It's And I find that in places that make things. You have to be very, very aware of, You're only a few weeks from bankruptcy. Right? If you take your eye off the ball. You can't take your eye off the factory.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:02:38]:

Right? You're in it. You're in the thick of it. So I think from from that standpoint, that kind of grit, right, that idea that actually, it's funny. 1 of our our seed investors said, You know how I hire an engineer? He's like, parents are still together. He said, from somewhere near Northeast Ohio And has lasted a few years at an engineering job anywhere in Ohio. And I'm like I'm like, that's pretty, Pretty narrow, focus. And he's like, I know. He goes, I've broken the rule many times.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:03:12]:

When he's like, in general, those are the men and women that stick with me for a very long time. Right? They're not trying to get to California, you know, they at least have some kind of value structure, and they've stuck it out of the manufacturer, which, you know, Northeast Ohio is not always glamorous. Right? It's not always a glamorous place to be, so it's difficult. But startup wise, I think the grid is a big part of it. Right? There's, Man, there's people here, like, my guys have been so freaking loyal to me. Right? Even can't pay them a few months, can't, you know, Basically, do the things like a a business needs to do. Well, they they stuck it out. Right? We hit a bump in the road and it looks like all is lost.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:03:54]:

We're going into bankruptcy. They Figure it out. We need help from a local manufacturer, they step up. You know, we we need help from an investor and and and he he reaches into his network and says, hey, call these guys. They'll they'll know how to fix this. So in terms of a manufacturing start up, Amazing, amazing ecosystem. Right? Grit. Total total grit.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:04:16]:

Just get it done sorta attitude. But what we're finding is, even on the tech side, we have a amazing community here of Tech creators. Right? Tech startups. And that's something I didn't know until we got into electric that there was such a big community here. And, you know, a lot of it's kinda these integrated medical devices. Right? IoT and and different, medical focus, but that transitions. Right? And We have a community of coders here, which I didn't know we had. We have a pretty robust tech ecosystem that that is, it's it's growing.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:04:51]:

I mean, that's pretty incredible. And, you know, when city leaders are trying to talk about Cleveland and change who we are, I always because we don't need to change. Like, you know, I witnessed a city in China, Sushi, while I was there. It's south of Shanghai. Go from a literal fishing village to a thriving metropolis. When I started, people were on bicycles. The factory now had to then the parking lot, everyone's driving cars, like, the the middle class grew through manufacturing. Right? I witnessed it in front of my eyes.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:05:24]:

The wealth of the city grew through manufacturing. And it wasn't your dumb, old, dirty manufacturing. It was tech enabled, You know, it's high-tech manufacturing. And the wealth of that entire city grew as their manufacturing might grew, and the the tech grew. Like, one of the largest Ebike companies in the world started in this teeny little city and they they're selling over 6,000,000 ebicycles a year in China. It's a high-tech company that grew out of this kind of fishing village, like, manufacturing core. And I see a realization in in Cleveland and Ohio, you know, Kyle over county, that, you know, maybe we don't have to compete strictly on a a tech side. We can do that, but we don't have to be that.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:06:06]:

So I I think the start up community, if you're doing tech enabled hardware, if you're doing anything with batteries, right, anything with transportation, It's a great place to be. I just don't think a lot of people know it, at least not yet, but we're gonna change that. The people here know it. Right? We know that. Yep. And I mean, I I just heard so Fisker, electric car manufacturers gonna be making their cars, just 45 minutes from here in Lordstown. Right? You know, we have Lordstown down there, which still wanna get in the political, what's going on there, but at least it appears that we have a electric car manufacturer in Ohio. You know, Honda's here.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:06:44]:

So the ecosystem For me, if we look selfishly, like, specifically at what we're doing, batteries, check. Coaters, check. Tech workers, check. Manufacturing know how? Check. Automotive parts suppliers? Check. And, desire from the government to push advanced manufacturing forward? Check. So, you know, the land wins is winning. Right? We're we're starting to win and and there's a incredible culture.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:07:11]:

I will say on the philanthropic side? We talked kind of offline about that, but I think our city leaders and our our philanthropic community need to stop shuffling money between themselves, and actually, you gotta invest in some failures. Right? If it's not me, it's it's not just about us. It's about building the community here. Not everything's gonna be a winner. So I think that realization or that, you know, only investing in a sure thing, that's probably one of the or only investing in incremental changes? That's one thing that that drives us a little crazy. And I'm gonna throw you under the bus here. Mhmm. Maybe, maybe not.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:07:50]:

I I'm sure you've talked about this, but we were talking about this kind of secret that's not a secret that, most people trying to start a startup in Cleveland feel that the organizations that are supposed to be helping us are failing a 100% at at what what we're trying to do. And that might just be entrepreneurs being too, maybe we're too bullish, but, you know, we're gonna keep pushing that that side of things forward, voice our discontent, and and make that side get better because a thriving start up community here is it's important.

Jeffrey Stern [01:08:25]:

It is important. And it requires an appetite for risk And an understanding of of what that entails.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:08:32]:

Yep. And and I would say that's probably the biggest thing is that the nonprofit community here and the investment community here, They'll invest in real estate. Great. They will put a lot of money into real estate and you can see the cities thriving because of that, but it's a fairly low risk endeavor. Right? When I talk and I, you know, as I listen to your podcast and talk to other startups from the city, a lot of the investment is coming from outside the city. A lot of money is coming in from outside and I think we all have a desire to, you know, stay within. Like, there's this kind of, Every Clevelander's proud that they're from Cleveland, right? Like, no matter where I go, I could beat people in Shanghai, I could meet people in Hong Kong and Indonesia, and they're gonna tell you right away they're from Cleveland. So it's kind of a pride there, and, you know, we want that local support.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:09:19]:

I know you guys want it. Other start ups want it. It's it's growing, but It could get better. I think we can could always do better. Right?

Jeffrey Stern [01:09:26]:

Can always do better. That's for sure. Yep. Well, in the spirit of Things that we know about Cleveland that other people may not know about. This is the essence of, the closing question, which is For hidden gems in Cleveland? The very, specifically, things that other people may not know about.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:09:46]:

Yeah. That's that's a good one. I learned a lot of the hidden gems from your your past, podcasties here. I'm gonna keep mine. And they They tend to go towards food. Don't they? We're a big food food and beer community here. I'm gonna go I'm gonna stick with the moto theme. We have one of the best and biggest mountain bike parks in the world.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:10:07]:

It happens to be indoors. It is Ray's Mountain Bike Park. And, we are lucky to have such an amazing business and institution here in Cleveland. If you've never been to Ray's Indoor Mountain Bike Park, and it is Ray, r a y, I would suggest you get on YouTube right now and and look up some videos. I got my son in, my daughters, and all into bicycling, but, you know, it's not great weather for 6 months out of the year. And it's amazing to have a several 100,000 square foot factory for fun, right in our backyard. So I would encourage everyone to support Ray's. It is a Very, very unique place.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:10:49]:

There is nothing else like it in the world, and it is right here in Cleveland, Ohio.

Jeffrey Stern [01:10:53]:

That's a that's an excellent one. And, I'll I'll encourage everyone also to and and you can provide the the destination here, Scott. But to to take a look at The visual of of what of what Scott is building at land and, and even at at Cleveland Cycle Works. I I think Having the visual counterpart to our auditory commentary here is a nice is a nice couple of kinda paints the picture of literally of, you know, What this stuff looks like. It's it's cool. It's very cool to see.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:11:24]:

So very simply, if you just type in land. Bike, l a n d. B I k e, That will take you directly to our website. You can explore the distributed energy and and whatnot. If you just Google land Emoto, land Ebike, land motorcycle. You will get a whole bunch of content from YouTube and Instagram and all that. And, yeah, that's about it. It's pretty easy to find us and we are building our company right here in Cleveland.

Jeffrey Stern [01:11:52]:

Awesome. Well, thank you for coming on, Scott, and and sharing your story. It's a very cool one at that.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:11:58]:

I appreciate you reaching out. I hope I didn't go too in-depth. You know, I'm stuck here all day with a bunch of absolute geeks. We've been geeking out on this for 18 months and we have not really been talking to too many people. So this is a great outlet for me because we have been sitting here ruminating and thinking and thinking and thinking. So tremendous data dump and it it's a great outlet for me, so I appreciate you, allowing me to have that.

Jeffrey Stern [01:12:25]:

Absolutely. My pleasure. Excited for everyone to to take a Listen.

Scott Colosimo (LAND Energy & Cleveland CycleWerks) [01:12:29]:

Awesome. Well, thank you.

Jeffrey Stern [01:12:32]:

That's all for this week. Thank you for listening. We'd love to hear your on today's show. So if you have any feedback, please send over an email to jeffrey@layoftheland.fm or find us on Twitter at podlay of The land or at sternjefe, j e f e. If you or someone you know would make a good guest for our show, please reach out as well and let us No. And if you enjoy the podcast, please subscribe and leave a review on iTunes or on your preferred podcast player. Your support goes a long way to help us Spread the word and continue to bring the Cleveland founders and builders we love having on the show. We'll be back here next week at the same time to map more of the land